tv CNN Special Report CNN May 12, 2014 7:00pm-8:01pm PDT
it's all the same. how you look and where you come from, the only thing that really counts is the person you are. a big week for divas in beards and defensive ends with boyfriends and love and acceptance. i'm bill weir, cnn special report starts right now. >> we have a great show for you >> we have a great show for you tonight. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com your result is pouring in. what does donald sterling have against magic johnson in sterling thinks he is beloved by the team and the controversy is the media's fault. >> elgin baylor has nothing to do with the things i said 20 years later. what did it have to do? >> elgin baylor claimed you had a plantation mentality. and you say you feed these guys -- >> i think you have more of a
plantation mentality than i do. >> this hour, reaction from my team of experts. and you. and the kiss seen around the world. michael sam becomes the first openly gay player drafted into the nfl. his seb tour kiss sparks emotion, judgment and more. be, honest. did it catch you off guard. this looks to be jay z, boon onsay and her sister in a scuffle. what happened inside this elevator? let's start with donald sterling and michael sam. two men in the spotlight brings focus to issues of race, bigotry and tolerance or intolerance. donald sterling revealed the depths of his racism and he didn't help his own case. michael sam had an emotional
moment months in the making. he kissed his boyfriend live on national television on a sports channel. relieved his decision to be himself didn't cost him his career. did that further tolerance or widen the divide? not everyone was on board including some professional athletes. at least two were black men. here's the question. the same voices who denounced donald sterling, where are they in support of michael sam? i want to bring in cedric maxwell, who played for sterling's clippers. he is with the sports hub in boston. kenneth shrob sire. jay thomas, an actor and host on sear yus radio. and here next to me on the hot seat is mel robbins. so mel, you're in the hot seat.
you heard the apology from donald sterling. he says he's not a racist. >> i almost spit on you i was laughing so hard. his wife says he has dementia. >> possibly. >> come on. the finney thing, he walked out of the studio and i had a chance to talk to him. i said to him, anderson, i guarantee you when you walk into work tomorrow there is going to be a bouquet of flowers from adam silver. all he has to do is hit play on that thing and do an up and down vote. >> let's look at more. he did call anderson a racist. watch. >> i think you have more of a plantation mentality than i do. you know what? i think you're more of a racist than i am. i'm not a racist. and i've never been a racist or
will have be a racist. you're asking me about questions. what do you mean a mentality? >> a plantation mentality is to feel you own these guys. they're working for you. >> do i own them? >> i don't know. >> my players earn $100 million a year. now do i own them? >> also says 25%, cedric, of my whole gang are black people and i love them. >> it's absolutely absurd when you think about donald sterling said. he has dug the biggest whole i've ever seen a dude do. if you have any sympathy at all that has gone away. it is stupid when you listen to things he said. over and over he is talking about black people and evokes magic johnson of all things? his attorneys must be cringing right now. maybe he is just playing the stupid card and that gives him right that everybody to have
sympathy for him. >> let's listen to what he said about magic johnson. >> what kind of guy goes to a city and has sex with every girl and catches hiv. is that someone i want to respect and tell our kids about? i think he should be ashamed of himself and go into the background. what does he do for the black people? he doesn't do anything. >> jay? whoever is advising should be fired. if no one is advising him, he needs to hire someone to do it. >> corn bread! >> hey, man. >> i can't believe we are back together again talking about this. >> i knew that would happen. jay, what do you make of that? >> when i started as a basketball and sports announcer. i didn't know anything about anything. cedric "cornbread" maxwell was the leader of the uncc charlotte
basketball team. i think that donald sterling should go to jail for that dye job alone. that is the worst hair i've ever seen. he's an old fart. everybody knows how insulated people. are believe it or not that's just part of his insulation. i see it in hollywood all the time people who are never said no to or are right all the time. he has no idea. >> is it more of a question of what's the word -- entitlement than racism? >> i think there's a bubble around the guy, don. >> jay? >> yeah, absolutely. he is totally entitled, when we are doing well, we have a bubble around us. my bubble has been gone for a long time. but there was a time i could do no wrong and people were saying
yes to me and stuff and you forget what real life is like and you say ridiculous things and the next thing you know you are held up for what you said. >> so, ken, sterling went on to make inflammatory statements about african-americans. watch this. >> that's one problem i have, jews, when they get successful, they will help their people. and some of the african-americans, maybe i'll get in trouble again. they don't help anybody. what has magic johnson really done for children's hospitals which kids are lying in the hallways. they're sick and need a bed. >> the magic johnson foundation has raised millions of dollars for all types of causes do. you think that he knows how
offensive his comments are. >> he must -- he must not have any idea at all. i grew up in the crenshaw area of l.a. it is appalling that donald sterling would turn this into a personal attack on to a man who has come so far. in 1991, companies pulled away from magic because of the hiv. >> he didn't have to reveal that to anyone. >> exactly. and so if anything with sterling, maybe in the 1990s. i believe he is further than that. but she in the frame of mind that there is a negative con notation because he is hiv positive. the sexism, the racism and now this discrimination against people because they are hiv positive. >> it's crazy. >> you know, i hate magic.
i hated magic as a basketball player. but i tell you what, as a black man i respect him and really appreciate everything he's done. >> thank you for saying that. >> donald sterling may be gearing up for a war with the nba but he may have other opponents to worry about, like his estranged wife. that's next.
honestly, the off-season isn't i've got a lot to do. that's why i got my surface. it's great for watching game film and drawing up plays. it's got onenote, so i can stay on top of my to-do list, which has been absolutely absurd since the big game. with skype, it's just really easy to stay in touch with the kids i work with. alright, russell you are good to go! alright, fellas. alright, russ. back to work!
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him out? he gave something to indicate today. he said it didn't make sense for this argument to go back and for both parties to spend a lot of money. i think there is a greater chance than there was. the real confusion comes between the spouses, the two sterlings. that's where the battle may begin and the rights she makes. >> here's what i think. i think he's trying to play the good cop and get his reputation restored and repaired and the public perception and she's going out there -- >> she's playing a different game altogether. i think she is gearing up for divorce court. she has a bigger argument in divorce court. >> i want to hear what sterling said about the media. watch this. >> the players don't hate me. the sponsors don't hate me. >> you don't -- >> the fans don't hate me.
the media hates. it's all the media pushing it. but -- >> you honestly believe it? >> i believe it 100%. i believe people call me by the thousands and have given me support. high they don't say i should have said that. >> pick your job. the media loves you. this is a story like rob ford. >> let me say that with all this discrimination and who we can and can't say things about, i love make fun of everybody. i think it's wonderful that we can still make fun of old, rich, stupid, white guys and i hope that never dies and i hope that we'll always have that right and i'll go to my grave defending that right. he's an idiot. a complete idiot. his wife is an idiot. when he had dates with young
girls he would have dates in the house with the wife and they would go to the movies and hold hands with the girlfriend while he was still married. why does god give these kinds of people a lot of money. i'm beeaching god. why? if i held hands -- if my wife saw me helping an old lady across the street we're in divorce court. >> they have a relationship based on money. she said she wanted to divorce him 20 years ago and hasn't because of the money. >> unconventional, to say the least. sterling apologized to his 29 partners in the league. he said some support him. do you think he has a shot of maintaining ownership of this team? >> like a snowball in hell. there is no way he getting in a
position of getting anyone to support him. that is political suicide right now. think of it. if you are the owner of an nba team and you side with donald sterling and people find out about it? how are you going to tell your players? how are you going to explain this to anybody who really thinks that you are worth anything? >> okay. so let's get back to the idea again, because i think -- i think he -- we'll talk about that after this. anderson pressed him on the idea that sterling believes his team loves him. >> you don't think the players don't like you. when the clippers -- >> why wouldn't they like me -- >> when they reversed their jerseys. >> if one does it the others have to do it. >> you think it's just from --? >> do you think they're all going to walk off the team? can any of us just stop working? we all have to earn a living and
all have bills. we may work for an employer we don't love. i contend they love me. >> you think they still love you? >> i do. >> he probably thought that by seeing this people would go he's a misunderstood man and most people are going oh, my gosh and laughing at him. if he continues on in this -- delusional, quite honestly -- in this vein if this drags out, how disease this continue? >> maybe cedric could say something to this. from what i'm hearing doc rivers say it sounds like doc rivers if he continues to be the owner, i don't think doc rivers would sign on for next year. >> and he is really holding the clippers together and the league. >> yes. >> doc is doing a great job of holding everything together
right now. he is absolutely doing a great job. of holding everything together. i love what doc rivers is doing. one thing that is happening with doc rivers, make a point about it. doc rivers has to be on board and say the right things to keep all the players together. >> and ken, i hear you mentioning dick parsons of time warner. i was like finally, daddy's home. something's going to happen or mommy's home. >> i didn't take it that way. >> but he said we just want to keep the boat moving and turn the flame down. and that's why i'm here. and that's going to be the nba commissioner's decision, and not me. >> the aura of leadership, the business presence -- it was a powerful moment. apart from the donald sterling tom foolery that took place today, the parsons moment was strong in terms of the ship's
going to be okay if we do the right thing. >> and my favorite part of the press conference was why did it take him so long? donald sterling faces a legal battle versus the nba but it might be a two-front war. he may be fighting his own wife. more on that next. capital to make it happen? without the thinking that makes it real? what's a vision without the expertise to execute it...
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i pity him and i feel sorry for him. >> is it the battle of the sterlings as they battle the nba. donald sterling's emotional apology. >> i'm a good member who made a mistake and i'm apologizing and asking for forgiveness. >> versus his estranged wife's legal claim to the team. >> the nba's position so far, like it or not, the sterlings are in this together. under the nba constitution if a controlling owner's interest is terminated by a three quarter vote all other team owners' interests are automatically terminated as well budget her attorneys do not accept that argument. we do not agree with the league's self serving interpretation of its institution its application to shelly sterling. her position is stronger if she
did not sign the league papers to purchase the team back in 1981. >> if donald was the only signer and it's a community property interest shelly could say that's great. you signed it. but i didn't sign it. >> another shot fired by shelly sterling this weekend could help donald's case against the nba. >> he saw the tape and he said i don't remember saying that. that's when i thought he has dementia. >> how could this be used in a legal argument by donald sterling himself? >> donald could say if he is suffering from diminished capacity he didn't have the capacity to make the league look bad. >> for now the team is being run by dick parsons. donald sterling wants his team back. >> they are clippers and they're mine and i'm theirs.
that's how i feel. i would do anything for them. i made a mistake. i hope it's in their heard to forgive me for that mistake. >> jean casarez, cnn, new york. >> back now with my panel of experts. they are answering your questions now. we're going to hear more the your eyes don't roll back in your head. >> now you know what my kids see all the time. >> he says he just wants to be forgiven. >> i made a mistake. i hope it's in their heart to forgive me. >> you are saying you were set up? >> yes. that's not the why i talk. . >> can you be set up and say things that you don't feel if it's not in your heart? >> no. it's interesting. it's everybody else's fault but
his. it's the media's fault and v. stiviano's fault. it sounds like the lyrics for a country music song. this is a guy who lives in a bubble and doesn't think what he did was wrong and doesn't understand why does the world -- why, don, why does the world hate little old me. i'm a nice guy. i love my players. i have done so much for those people in l.a. >> if you or anyone go to me, i would never say don't bring white people around. i would never think of. that. >> he doesn't understand what he did was wrong. >> he is ruminating. he cannot string a clear sentence together. he is saying, magic johnson's going to buy my team. why is he a good guy? why is he better than me? what has he done? >> he said he was jealous. he didn't want other black
guys -- >> was she sleeping with him? i don't want to think about that. >> i want to get the questions in. >> you know what, the only excuse he could have is if she were naked and she wasn't. that would make you say anything. and the second thing is with he and his wife the movie ought to be titled "greedy and greedier" they are two evil old white people and i'm going to discriminate against them for the rest of my life. >> for cedric, darrell said donald sterling deserves forgiveness but he does not deserve to own an nba team? does he deserve forgiveness? >> everybody does. i think everybody does -- everybody does deserve some kind of forgiveness. but he keeps digging a deeper and deeper hole. if you want to forgive him you can't do it because when he puts his foot in his mouth. >> every time he opens his mouth
the wrong thing comes out. >> absolutely. >> this is for ken. this tweet is -- from georgia. georgia says, we must consider donald sterling has early undiagnosed dementia, losing inhi bagss and cognition control. do you agree with that, ken? >> i don't know. i'm not a medical professional. but even with that, that's another reason that the league could move away from him as an owner. the end of the story this may cost some money but court is not going to say you must keep this man as your partner. it doesn't make any sense. >> okay. all right. thank you, guys. i appreciate it. your thoughtful conversation on this matter but i want you to stay around. a young man celebrates his entry into the nfl with his friends, family, and a kiss from his loved one. doesn't sound controversial, or
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realized when he received a call from the st. louis rams. here's what happened. >> this is the moment where michael sam got the news he is going to be a member of the st. louis rams. >> a euphoric moment and a celebrity tour kiss. member robbins is with me. hello, horde. thank you for joining us. you know this young man well. you have guided him through this process. how long have you been working with michael sam since before the draft? >> about three months. we started our relationship in february. and he stayed at my house and has vito. i know them very well. >> what did you think of this reaction to this kiss, this
moment on television? >> i didn't expect it. a lot of people said we scripted it. i promise you it wasn't. it was a spontaneous moment. i thought it was wonderful. i'm getting positive reactions to it. and there are a few people who are not as comfortable with it. >> for those whory "r" saying this moment is about michael sam and that moment made the point about his relationship and not just him. what do you say? >> there is a moment of a.j. mccarron kissing his girlfriend. and i think his girlfriend got a boost in her career for it. part of life, part of celebrating the most important moment in your life is celebrating with the people you love. and that was authentic. that's what happened. >> obviously, michael sam, and listen, i don't want to assume this, he was worried that coming out would affect his career,
right, howard? >> well, we knew it was a possibility. but the truth is, michael wasn't in the closet. when we talk about michael sam coming out, his team knew, the media knew. whether or not michael sam went to the media and said, i'm a gay man, it was going to be out before the draft. >> he didn't talk about it publicly. >> not until march. >> so -- >> and it became clear. >> tell us the back story here, though, howard. i think that you told me -- i spoke with you earlier today and you said basically people think this moment was scripted. but he was upstairs and he thought his prospects of being drafted were over and he was inconsolable because he thought his career was over. >> up until six or seven minutes before that was shot we were convinced he was going to go the free agent route and wasn't going to be drafted. and all of a sudden the call
came in from st. louis and everything changed. and we rushed michael downstairs and michael and vito came down and that call came and it was one of the most beautiful, genuine moments i've ever seen. history was being made. >> i'm going to tell my reaction. howard, please stay around. i will bring my panel in. also joining me is brian stelter, host of "reliable sources." okay, so i want to go through my panelists and ask you in the spirit of having an open and honest discussion what was your gut reaction when you saw this kiss? >> that it was pretty startling in terms of how authentic it was. and for me, don, the thing that was amazing is that typically when people see gay men and women expressing themselves it is on bravo or hgtv.
for this to take place in this context made it startling for a lot of people. >> cedric, what was your initial reaction? >> i was really surprised. and i was somewhat shocked. but shame on me for feeling that way. because as the gentleman said before if it had been a man and a woman it would not have been a problem at all. i think because we are professional athletes we have a sanctuary and that sanctuary is one we look at and say this won't happen. we won't have a man kissing a man on it have if he is playing football. that has to go away. >> ken, what did you think initially? >> youthful exuberant and honest moment. this is a guy who had gone through a lot. this is the excitement of the draft happening for him. >> jay thomas? >> if that's what you're going to do the first day, you better
with ready to knock the cold crap out of somebody the first day of practice. i said this guy is a tough son of a bitch and is going to speak on the field and kiss a man in the parking lot. i love trouble. i love this guy. >> brian stelter? >> my reaction? it's about time. >> i have to tell you my reaction. i'm a gay man. i was startled. i had never seen two men kiss on television in that particular situation and i was with other -- i was with other straight people, my straight friends and we were watching and we just looked at each other and were like, wow, what just happened? i was startled. it took me aback and i started thinking about all these things, it's not about his boyfriend and about him. i wondered if i had a bit of bias. but i went -- >> but there is an intimacy there. >> i wonder if it was appropriate -- >> but you know why?
he started like this, don. he was con vulsing. he was crying so hard. the embrace was so intense. >> i interviewed robin roberts. she came out a few months ago. what she said to me what was she supposed to do? shake his boyfriend's hand? >> i agree. >> you know what, that's right. >> if you're in the moment, people kiss their girlfriends and boyfriends all the time. but here's the thing, howard, that is so important that people should realize, a lot of people are not accepting gay people who come out and are not accepted by their families. this is his family. that young man is his family and the person who is closest to him and that's who i would want to kiss howard, go ahead. >> if you know michael's back story you know he does not have a wonderful relationship with his family. his family is kind of hard scrabble texas family.
a couple siblings in jail, a couple killed. michael brought himself up almost by himself out of the ashes to become the man he has. he does not have blood family. blood family was not there for him at that moment. vito and a few others are michael's family and this was truly an authentic moment. and when you come out of the closet like michael did you are living your truth. this is another part of living your truth. and that was the most authentic, honest moment we've seen in a long time. and it was beautiful and it will go down in history for a lot of reasons. >> everyone seems to be in agreement here but there are people who disagree and think it may increase the divide not close the divide. >> how? >> because it was so startling.
>> howard, he was accepted by the missouri football team and coaching staff. i'm not seeing him interviewed anywhere. was he accepted wholeheartedly? >> yes. >> i'm not seeing these tough guys -- a great football team and great coaching staff. where are they? >> didn't you get a note from mizzou? >> no. >> howard? >> me? >> yeah. >> yeah. i got a note from the sports information director today, who sent me a posting on mizzou website and it was about a military family, a tough, conservative family and they were watching this together and there was a 15-year-old son and if you follow me on twitter you see this. and it's about their 15-year-old son and they're watching this and as soon as they did this, the son burst into tears and he said i'm gay and i want to live my truth to.
if michael sam has saved one family and one kid. his family embraced him and told them they loved him. >> one more thing to build on that. i watched this with my three kids. one of the things that was so amazing is that none of them were nonplussed by this other than to say how awesome, oh, that's so cute. >> that's young people. but the adults are all like he kissed a guy. it's too passionate. too bad it's not like a -- >> would you like to kiss me on national television. >> now sit down. >> too bad it's not like a little peck. >> a gay black man and a married white woman. this is scandalous. hi, honey. >> a lot of people including derick ward commented that kids would have been watching the draft and espn shouldn't have shown the kiss. i think mel makes a point. older people may have an issue
not all older people. but for younger people, they don't really care. >> well, i think to think about this -- you look at everything that is happening rite now. you look over and over again all over the world, kids can get anything they want to. why are we thinking that we are trying to cover up something right now by not showing the kiss? my kids go on the internet and i don't know what they might be watching. >> brian seltzer, were when they used to show the butt of the guy and -- how many times have we seen straight people make out on camera and have sex on television in the middle of primetime forever? >> i'm personally more worried about violence on tv than sexuality on tv. we have seen a lot of gay characters embrace and kiss on tv, men and women. but what was different is this
is a real life celebrity and not an actor on "modern family" or something like that. but it is only a one or with the degree of difference from those shows which has contributed to people's growing tolerance and acceptance. >> it may have been difference because it was an athlete on the sports channel. >> and i think it was the emotional that shocked people. >> more on michael sam's historic moment. and a new video from some of the world's biggest music stars but not the type they typically star in. world's biggest music stars but weekdays are for rising to the challenge.
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there's a lot of focus on the kiss between michael sam and his boyfriend. but what will life be like for an opening gay player in the nfl. and cedric, michael sam was the lowest drafted s.e.c. player of the year. and 248 players went ahead of him. did coming out hurt his career? >> i don't think it hurt his career. i think they evaluate him as a player right now. i happened to sit with jason collins who was the openly gay
player with the celtics when he played last year and a couple years ago. and the real thing i understood about him is the fact that i tried to put myself in his shoes trying to think that how afraid he was that someone was going to find out. but once it came out, i just thought, man, how relieved he was as a person, and as a player to go out and finally play the game that he's always loved. >> but here's the reality though, kenneth. here are the draft positions of the past players of the year, in 2003, the first year of the award, a player went in the fifth round. every year since then in the first round accept one in the second round. it's hard to look at that and say that coming out didn't hurt him or at least affect where he was picked in this draft. >> look, is there someone who may have been biassed in the
decision-making process? probably so. is there someone that didn't make a business decision that this would be a distraction? probably so. but it's difficult to judge talent transitioning from college to the pros. it's a combination of things. i don't think we could say it is a discriminatory decision. >> the rams tweeted this statement from michael sam from last season alone. he said i should have been in the first three rounds, s.e.c. defensive player of the year and all american. the rams are embracing michael sam. they are retweeting something he tweeted. >> there may have been teams that looked in the other direction from him, the rams are going to benefit from picking him. the rams are going to benefit from all across the country in different ways. they may end up being even happier about the decision than they would be for that reason. >> so, jay, he brings up a very
good point. don't you think that some of the teams who passed on him may have seen that kiss and said, see, boy, we did not have to deal with that. >> yeah, and by the way, they're not saying he did not do well at the combine. i hate to say this, but i don't know if that's true or not. but they say they have times and strength tests and say he did not do well in the combine. i also believe and go back to jeff fisher again. i believe that jeff fisher spoke to team leaders and his ownership. they do all of this research. and i think the other teams looked at their locker rooms and -- if you have a locker room filled with evangelical football players you're not going the take a gay linebacker on your team. i'm sorry. there's no room for all those guys in the center of the field praying with a guy holding hands with a man when he goes to the
locker room. i think it was a business decision. i really want this guy to do well. he's going to have a rough season and i think if they are cursing or curse him i hope those flags are thrown. that is a new rule in the nfl if you curse on the field, you get a flag. if there is a queer or a fag thrown on the field, they need to be flagged. >> and statistically there were other football players drafted in the last few days who are gay. they have just not come out. maybe this will mayke it easier >> howard -- >> yeah, man. >> jay says he is accepting a rough season. are you expecting one for him? >> i think all nfl rookie can expect a rough season. it's tough to go from college and make in the nfl. but i can tell you this, people
talked a lot about distraction. that was the buzz word used all along the thing. the most focused person in this whole process has been michael sam. and -- >> all right. >> he has done -- he has done three interviews now and one press conference. he'll do another one tomorrow. we are blocking for him so he can focus on being a football player. that's what he intends to do. >> and i can't wait to have that interview with him. that one-on-one sit down. i thank you in advance for. that coming up, shock surveillance video has surfaced and it appears to be between two of the world's biggest music stars.
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tmz published a video with a woman who looks like jay z's sister-in-law. so first off, i have been waiting all day to do this finally say that, you know, jay z has 99 problems and selange knowles may be one. >> it looks like someone picked a fight with her brother-in-law and to jay z's credit. he did nothing. >> let's talk about how this tape got leaked. the standard hotel in new york has responded to the release of this video and they say we are shocked and disappointed there was a clear breach of our security system and
confidentiality we count on providing our guests. we will discipline and prosecute the individuals involved in to our fullest capacity. >> not good for that hotel chain. they pride themselves on having their celebrity guests. it won't hurt them in the long run but not good today. think about house cliven bundy was taken down by an audio tape. none of the people involved have commented. tomorrow we'll be in for something. somebody will have to explain what happened. >> i mean, if the this is them on the tape how unusual is this for them? >> well, it's very unusual but beyonce looked nonplussed by the whole thing. that's the part. so they have a very good team.
they manage -- very well. this cannot be making them happy assuming it's them and now we know why jay z has body guards all the time. don't we. >> we saw them before, you know, before at this party. and there them on the red carpet and then we see them afterwards after afterwards they leave and they put beyonce and solange in the same car and jay z goes to a different car. and solange goes, nope. you're going back. >> this is before the fight? >> or after? >> that was after the fight. >> go ahead, jay. >> not to be discriminatory. i said stuff about old, rich, white people. i want to say every now and again it's great to see a really rich black guy get his ass beat by his sister-in-law. >> jay, you have been an equal
opportunity offender tonight. you have offended old white people and young black guys. rich. >> all rich people. all very rich. nobody middle class. >> i appreciate all of you. that's it for us tonight. i'm don lemon. thanks for watching, "ac360" thanks for watching, "ac360" starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com good evening, everyone. tonight at 360 exclusive for the first time since he was banned from the nba for making racist comments donald sterling speaks out. i sat down with the embattled l.a. clippers owner in his beverly hills home for a no-holds-barred interview. there was no pr entourage telling him what to say or stop. these are his words and his alone. we spoke for about an hour and 20 minutes and for the first hour sterling was apologetic, denied he was a racist. and says he was goaded by v. stiviano. he was baited to say things he never would have. then towards the end he said some things that many of you will find shocking what he said ofout magic johnson will be